Joe Viglione P.O. Box 2392 Woburn, MA 01888 email: firstname.lastname@example.org
You've reached Varulven.com and JoeViglione.com
. To get to our label, Varulven Records or to Joe Vig's Top 40 just click on our front page Varulven.com and JoeViglione.com
. As we continue to build this site you will find links galore that will take you to many facets of the Varulven Empire's inter-dimensional worlds. "The Demo That Got The Deal" tm is my radio program and a book we are writing about how each record deal is a story unto itself. The demos make for great listening too! Visual Radio is the television program Visual-Radio.net
. or Visual Radio on Myspace
. Thousands of recordings of songs from our Varulven artists, hundreds and hundreds of hours of videotape, thousands of hours of audiotape and zillions of words of text will find their way onto these pages. The Varulven Pages.
Contents Copyright 2007 Joe Viglione All Rights Reserved. If you want to quote me, please ask permission and please link back to this site. Updated at 2:58 PM with Buzzy Linhart on the phone, April 22, 2009
Some rare Bobby Hebb from our third Visual Radio program!
Welcome to JoeViglione.com It is Sunday morning at 12:10 AM. Just came back from a recording session at Newbury Sound / Newbury Media in Wilmington, Mass. We're working on a new compilation, Boston Rock & Roll Anthology #21, the 21st volume of Boston area music released on the Varulven label. All these masters were recorded or re-mixed at Newbury Media. Working on my "Space Age Bachelor Pad" essays, SPACE AGE BACHELOR PAD MUSIC
The Space Age Bachelor Pad site is a nice complement to our movie site: Joe Vig Movie Soundtrack Reviews
We are busy working on The Salt Water Summers, our independent movie, and resurrecting tracks from the Varulven Record label. Lots going on! And you'll get the news on our escapades right here on Varulven.com before you read it anywhere else!
Check out our plethora of links at the bottom of this page - tons of reviews and fun sites that we are involved with. Many of Joe Vig's reviews for AMG which have been picked up by Sony/BMG's LEGACY label are included along with Billboard.com (hundreds of them), Barnes & Noble.com, Country Music Channel.com etc. etc. etc!
Watch for new reviews and TV show listings to be placed here! Today is Tuesday August 14, 2007, have a nice day!
Check out the Willie "Loco" Alexander article in North Shore Sunday Willie Loco Alexander in North Shore Sunday by Joe Vig
Oh, and for those who can't find our Music Business Monthly page written by Gary "Pig" Gold, it is now here: Music Business Monthly
Joe Viglione edits or is involved with these sites:
Bobby Hebb on Myspace
Bobby Hebb's official blog
Marty Balin on MySpace
Jo Jo Laine
Record Producer Jimmy Miller
Jimmy Miller on Myspace
Joe Viglione on Myspace
Joe Viglione's Guide to New England Music
Effortless Masters & Rob Fraboni
Rob Fraboni on MySpace
Buzzy Linhart's Blog
Jimi Hendrix Reviews
Life's Work CD by Joe Viglione
Purchase Life's Work on Emusic.com
Joe Viglione on ROCKLINK.com
New Changes album
Varulven Records on My Space
POWER POP SITE which has a photo of my first album: First album by Joe Vig
Link to the New Rose site with my discography and others: New Rose Records
These sites contain reviews written by Joe Viglione
Tommy Boyce and Bobby Hart's website points to my review of "I Wonder What She's Doing Tonight" BoyceandHart.com
Legacy Recordings - Janis Joplin/Big Brother & The Holding Co. 900 nights
Electric Flag on Legacy
Legacy's Patsy Cline CD, "Walkin' After Midnight: The Best of Patsy Cline"
Legacy reissues Barry Goudreau
Marvin Gaye on Legacy Recordings
The Irish Tenors on Legacy Recordings
Legacy: Barry Manilow Trying To Get The Feeling Again
Barry Manilow "Even Now" Legacy Recordings
Alice Cooper Brutally Live
Ray Charles / Live In Concert (Georgia Music Store)
Bobby Hebb webliners for UNI Music's re-release of the SUNNY CD
Genya Ravan's URBAN DESIRE webliners for UNI Music
Jo Jo Laine
Tons of Joe Viglione biographies on famous people here
VH1.com- Jefferson Starship - DEEP SPACE/Virgin Sky
MOTT THE HOOPLE AND IAN HUNTER
It's about time SOME kind of DVD concerning the adventures of MOTT THE HOOPLE got into release and this excellent biography special does a good job! Check out JustABuzz
their fan club for some great links! Mott The Hoople DVD - UNDER REVIEW
Ian Hunter's RANT on Wherehouse Music
Ian Hunter's RANT on MP3.com
Righteous Brothers Give it To The People MP3.com
Doors Weird Scenes Inside the Goldmine on Music.com (not to be confused with EMusic.com or Allmusic.com, just Music.com
Joe Vig's story on Kimberley Jaeger of WZLX
Joe Vig SOUNDTRACK REVIEWS - Very Cool CDs
Joe Vig review of Mar Y Sol compilation
Joe Vig review of Jon Butcher Axis on Sam Goody.com
Joe Viglione's review of Spiderman 3 in North Shore Sunday, #1 download of the week at NSS May 11, 2007
Frankie Valli review in STARPULSE
Brad Delp Appreciation in North Shore Sunday
Barry Mann - SURVIVOR album
WE GET LETTERS: To: Mr Joe Viglione From: "A SCOTSMAN" Date: Mon, August 13, 2007 11:57 am To: email@example.com I just wished to say, "Excellent summary of 'Survivor'". I'll highlight that page to a friend or two in an effort to instigate conversion to the Great Mann himself. Mark you, JimmyWebb's the greatest of them all. Rgds A.Scotsman
The above e mail is in regards to Barry Mann's SURVIVOR CD which is posted above the e mail. For TONS more Joe Vig reviews go here: Joe Vig's First Impressions with reviews of Tommy James, Jimmy Webb and tons more!
Rita Coolidge "Nice Feelin' on 97.3 EZRock
Rita Coolidge Nice Feelin' on Dose/Can West Media Works
Joe Viglione's reviews on Billboard.com
Marty Balin's EMI Best of Hearts & Other Favorites, a 1992 compilation of EMI music recorded by Marty Balin
Bob Dylan 1966 World Tour DVD
Bonnie Bramlett IT'S TIME on Billboard.com
Rubber Rodeo Heartbreak Highway
Sadaharu Biography on Billboard.com
Frankie Valli CLOSEUP 1975
Kim Carnes: Mistaken Identity
STARSHIP NO PROTECTION with Nothing's Gonna Stop Us Now
Olivia Newton-John IF You Love Me, Let Me Know
Captain & Tenille MAKE YOUR MOVE
Vic Damone Tenderly 1956 on Billboard.com
Phoebe Snow It Looks Like Snow
Dee Dee Sharp Gamble Happy Bout The Whole Thing
Janis Joplin Original Film Soundtrack
Roger Williams Roger Williams
Rare Earth One World
Leo Sayer Endless Flight
Samantha Sang Emotion
Alice Cooper Brutal Planet
Barry Mann - SURVIVOR album
Captain & Tenille Por Amor Viveremos
Tons of Billboard reviews
Tons more Billboard reviews
Hundreds and Hundreds of reviews on Billboard.com
Jon Butcher Ocean In Motion
Charlie Farren Bio on Barnes & Noble.com
Jon Butcher on Barnes & Noble An Ocean In Motion
Above are just SOME of the essays from Joe's pen picked up by Billboard.com
Charlie Farren on Vibe Magazine's Vixen.com
Chris Montez Time after Time on 650.CSL
Peter Noone Forum ONE OF THE GLORY BOYS
AimeeMann til tuesday review
Johnny Mathis Chances Are
ORION on MP3.com
PEPPERMINT RAINBOW - Spanky & Our Gang by way of STEAM's NA NA HEY HEY KISS HIM GOODBYE - or...how The Wonder Who sounded like Four Seasons with Frankie Vallihttp://tickets.artistdirect.com/nad/store/artist/album/0,,145133,00.html
All Music Guide Review
Did Ozzy Osborne perform on The Magic Lantern's "Shame Shame"? NO! Was the Peppermint Rainbow actually a "Wonder Who?" for Spanky & Our Gang? I'll never tell...
What happens when you take elements from two of Spanky & Our Gang's hits -- "Sunday Morning" and "Sunday Will Never Be the Same" -- create a sequel, and let veteran producer Paul Leka oversee the concept? You get a brilliant Top 35 hit from April of 1969, "Will You Be Staying After Sunday," by this little-known group out of Baltimore, the Peppermint Rainbow. Sisters Pat Lamdin and Bonnie Lamdin, singing in unison, sound like Elaine "Spanky" McFarlane, and the song has the same soaring melodic style that made "Sunday Will Never Be the Same" so precious two years prior to this. Leka would hit again in November of 1969 with Steam's "Na Na, Hey Hey, Kiss Him Goodbye," and has an impressive résumé ranging from Gloria Gaynor to songwriter Tim Moore's Behind the Eyes, and he hits a 90 percent with this album, which has a number of potential hits, from "Walking in Different Circles" to "I Found out I Was a Woman." The Lamdin sisters have a wonderful style, dipping into a Mamas & the Papas mode for "And I'll Be There" (Spanky McFarlane, after all, replaced Mama Cass in a latter-day Mamas & the Papas). There are more references to "Sunday" here, as well as on "If We Can Make It to Monday," a sequel to "Will You Be Staying After Sunday," written by the same songwriters. Paul Leka composed "Green Tambourine" for the Lemon Pipers, and it appears here as well, though in not as refined a form as the 1967 hit, this version a bit more folky. "Run Like the Devil" is the one turkey on here, one of the guys in the band not being able to hold his own on vocals, but with material by Barry Manilow/American Breed songwriter Scott English and superb production by Leka, the Peppermint Rainbow deliver a truly smart and entertaining pop album. ~ Joe Viglione, All Music Guide
<hr>Angel Of The Mornin' Merrilee Rush
Merrilee Rush by Merrilee Rush
Disc 1: 1. Save Me 2. You 3. Mama 4. Easy, Soft and Slow 5. Angel of the Morning 6. A Fool in Love 7. Love Birds 8. Could It Be Love I Found Tonight 9. Be True to You 10. Spare Me a Little of Your Love
MUSICMATCH REVIEW Producer Denny Diante had hit with Maxine Nightingale the year before this effort, and the thought of bringing back the gal who sang "Angel of the Morning" was certainly a noble idea. The self-titled album, Merrilee Rush, opens with "Save Me," sounding very much like the melody of Air Supply's 1980 hit "Lost in Love," making one wonder which was written first. Tom Snow's "You" was a hit for Rita Coolidge in 1978, so Diante and Rush had the right concept, and though the performance and sound is pretty good, Coolidge's production and spirit were deserving of the Top 25 status this song eventually garnered. Rush sounds as mature on this outing as Marianne Faithfull does in the passage of time between "As Tears Go By" and her comeback, Broken English. Rush's voice a bit tattered but charming on "Easy, Soft and Slow," one of the album's finest and most majestic moments. The star looks pretty on this album cover, perhaps a bit more seductive than she appears on her Turnabouts debut nine years prior. It's too bad she didn't cover Donna Weiss and Jackie DeShannon's "Bette Davis Eyes" instead of releasing a carbon copy of her 1968 top 10 hit, "Angel of the Morning." Weiss had written for the original Rush album on Bell nine years earlier, as had Mark Lindsay, Joe South, and John Phillips. There were also multiple Chip Taylor songs on her debut and maybe a cover of Taylor's composition for Janis Joplin, "Try (Just a Little Bit Harder)," would have been what the doctor ordered for this. Instead they seek redemption and almost get it by opting for a beautiful Christine McVie ballad from the sublime Bare Trees album by Fleetwood Mac. "Spare Me a Little of Your Love" should have been a hit for McVie prior to 1975's "Over My Head," and though the choice of material is fine, the hard rock guitar strips away the elegance of the original version. The gospel voices give this a Southern rock feel, not conducive to the chart success enjoyed by Helen Reddy and the aforementioned Rita Coolidge, and too drawn out to reach the market that embraced Linda Ronstadt's version of "Heatwave," although this tries to go in that direction. Because her voice changed so, as did the times, a more energized "Angel of the Morning" could have given this arty record a chance on FM radio. "Love Birds" borrows heavily from Tony Orlando & Dawn's "Candida," posing the question, did Diante and the record label know where they were taking Rush with this outing? "Could It Be Love I Found Tonight" is a big '70s ballad that would fit perfectly on a Melissa Manchester disc, but the production doesn't hit it out of the park. An endearing "Be True to You" starts country and goes back into the Manchester feel-good preaching that "Bridge Over Troubled Water" kicked the decade off with. An important work that needed just a bit more support to see it through. ~ Joe Viglione, All Music Guide
Beatles tribute ALL THIS AND WORLD WAR II on Music.com
Living Together: Burt Bacharach on MP3.com
UP OFF THE FLOOR by God Lives Underwater on Artist Direct.com
LOST IN THE STARS - the music of Kurt Weill on MUSIC.com
Alex Taylor on ANSWERS.COM
Girl's Night Out! Didi Stewart's band: Girls Night Out review
David Maxwell's webpage: Max Attack review
MSN review of ORION - Sometimes Words Just...
Rodney Crowell on Sam Goody.com
Small Worlds: The Crowell Collection 1978-1995 epitomizes why Rodney Crowell is a perfect example of the "new" country, a combination of styles creating slick pop music that would have had a tougher time in the '60s garnering the country & western play many of these songs achieved. There are lots of names lending their talents on these 21 tracks: Vince Gill, Dr. John, Emmylou Harris, Nicolette Larson, Booker T. Jones, Hal Blaine, and Russ Kunkel, among many others. "Let the Picture Paint Itself" borrows more from Elton John/Bernie Taupin's "Country Comforts" than it does from Jeannie C. Riley's "Harper Valley P.T.A.," though you can hear nicks of both melodies in this song, which is very different from both those tunes, and Roy Orbison lives again on Crowell's duet with former wife Rosanne Cash on the title track, "It's Such a Small World," as well as on "I Couldn't Leave You if I Tried" and "If Looks Could Kill." "If Looks Could Kill" is certainly not the song by Heart, but when Crowell references the Beatles and quotes their lyrics in "Lovin' All Night," one has to consider if the inspiration is coming from the land of Hank Williams or the realm where the sisters Wilson ruled. These influences seem to be co-writing with Rodney Crowell when he reads a brilliant lyric like, "What kind of love hears you when you pray?" in "What Kind of Love," composed by Crowell with Will Jennings and Roy Orbison, additional voices courtesy of Linda Ronstadt and Don Henley. Emulating Orbison by having his voice go into that texture is a tribute to his hero indeed, and very present on this "first multi-label career overview." Tracks were culled from releases on Warner Bros., Columbia, and MCA, making for another excellent collection from Australia's Raven Records with 21 tracks, over 77 minutes of music, all on one disc. And like 7-N/BMG's meticulous re-releases, Raven's come spilling over with definite and comprehensive liner notes, 16 pages here, making this repackaged music all the more vital for longtime fans as well as a great primer for the uninitiated. ~Joe Viglione, All Music Guide
Randy Bachman Site discussion of Joe V reviews
Guess Who #10 on Yahoo Music.com
Windows Media "Introducing The Doobie Brothers" rare demo cd
Christine "Perfect" McVie
Domenic Troiano on MSN
Star Trek Nemesis and A.I. Movie reviews by joe V
Discussion of joe Vig's review of The Doors WEIRD SCENES INSIDE THE GOLDMINE
Orion's SOMETIMES WORDS GET IN THE WAY on Dose.ca
Discussion of joe Vig's Velvet Underground mastering by Shawn Britton
Joe Vig's review of WHITE RABBIT, the song
by Joe Viglione (What's a Matrix thread without a discussion of White Rabbit?????)
From the Surrealistic Pillow album comes this song which, like the word surrealistic indicates, has "an oddly dreamlike or unreal quality". Few psychedelic moments can match Grace Slick's trance-like monotone perhaps inspired by having just read - Lewis Carroll: The Complete Illustrated Works: Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, Through the Looking-Glass and What Alice Found here. With hypnotic guitar work in the slow-march intro sounding like it was induced by F.A. Mesmer himself, it's all the more ominous in the harder rocking version released decades later on the Deep Space/Virgin Sky live reunion CD. Originally performed with The Great Society, this composition by Grace came right on the heels of "Somebody To Love" and instantly insured Ms. Slick superstardom with more Top 40 airplay in 1967 than her famous colleague Janis Joplin. With well over a hundred cover versions by such diverse acts as punk/new wavers The Damned, the hard rock Lizzie Borden (no relation to the new wave girl group produced by Genya Ravan) and, believe it or not, jazz maestro George Benson, it is Grace and her pharmaceutical prescription advice which is the definitive rendition and inspired the Keanu Reeves film The Matrix as much as James Cameron's The Terminator did. When in the movie Morpheus offers Neo the little red pill or the little blue pill, it is pure Grace Slick opening the door to wonderland with narcotics. Years later it is amazing the censors didn't put a stop to it, Janis Ian's "Society's Child" finding more problems with an interracial love affair than The Jefferson Airplane's window to another world. It's a classic in the truest sense of the world and always a pause for fun when it comes on the radio.
Scott Manning's EXCELLENT Matrix pages
52) Posted by: joe viglione January 22, 2005 3:18 AM
p.s. what I meant to say, Scott (and other people reading this), is that your page is an excellent site for Matrix fans. Thank you. I zip around the web looking for interesting Matrix sites and will put them in a blog as a handy "directory".
The quotes I put above focused on the emotions, "Love", "Hate" as well as hope and trust - the Wachowskis left it very open ended - a convenient excuse for some of the sloppy aspects of the what are magnificent films. But it is that intentional "open door" which has allowed for great discussion, and has made a tremendous impact on people thinking more deeply about mythology, philosophy, etc. and has enchanced the sci-fi experience. I could've done without the highway scene in "Reloaded" (imho Terminator 3 did a better chase scene - so much for Joel Silver and crew "revolutionizing" film again) and the violence is a bit gratuitous. The dialogue is fantastic, especially Merovingian.
Anyone notice how Neo and The Terminator are so closely aligned?
Arnold only spoke about 65 words in the first flick; both actors couldn't really act in the first film (brilliant casting), they learned as they went along the way, both Keanu and Arnold are much, much better than when they did the first flicks in both trilogies. Keanu (neo or neu, almost an anagram of part of his name) emerging with acting skills he didn't possess before this experience, just as his character emerged more polished. "You turned out alright" - yeah, if you got to act next to Gloria Foster you would be able to "sample" years of acting skill as well! David Bowie - Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf on Yahoo! Shopping.Music
Jack Bruce A Question of Time review
Thaddeus Hogarth reviews LIVE AT BOSE
Welcome to The Psychedelta by Kerry Kearney on MP3.com
Welcome to The Psychedelta by Kerry Kearney on FYE.com
Berlin Airlift on MP3
Neil Sedaka A SONG
Pavlov's Dog / Pampered Menial FYE
tiltuesday on Congoo.com
til tuesday on GoGamer.com
CD Connection Til Tuesday
Til Tuesday Barnes & Noble.com
Musicstore.connect.com Til Tuesday
til tuesday Iceberg Radio
Grateful Ted TIME MACHINE on MP3.com
Frankie Valli Closeup on Artist Direct
Here is Joe Viglione being quoted:
Joe Vig's LIVINGSTON TAYLOR review quoted in The Examiner
Quoted on Page 85 of this book:American History Through Music:Music of the Counterculture Era By James E. Perone
Richard Shindell's webpage - South Of Delia review by Joe Viglione
Book Review of David Nevue's How To Promote Your Music Successfully On The Internet Link to David Nevue's book
"Author David Nevue has created a direct and easy to understand roadmap for marketing your music on the world wide web. This book contains fundamentals that major artists, as well as those on independent labels, should read and absorb....David goes to the heart of the matter: Music Marketing Strategies That Bring Results!...It is a very well rounded catalogue of ideas, and the serious musician will find it an excellent starting point. Nevue's practical guide will get you thinking beyond the immediate gratification of hearing your song played a few times on Internet radio, to the more substantial art of selling records via the Internet." - Joe Viglione, for AllMusic.com
Following this Visual Radio website link is a great article on the show: Visual Radio hosted by Joe Viglione
Article about Joe Viglione in Boston Globe: Landing Big Names by Diana Brown
Joe Viglione Discography on DJangomusic.com
JOE VIGLIONE: A SHORT BIOGRAPHY
In 1969 at the age of 15 a young collector of 8mm science fiction/fantasy films, Joe Viglione, published Varulven Magazine in Arlington, Massachusetts. The fanzine's name taken from a used book written by Nordic author Aksel Sandemose (English title - The Werewolf, about the psychological aspects of a love triangle), it featured film reviews, an interview by writer Jim Miller with the late screen actress Ilona Massey- an article referenced in the book It's Alive as well as the DVD of Abbott & Costello Meet Frankenstein, coverage of Viglione's first two film shorts - Vlad, The Count Possessed and Two Nights Of Terror, interviews with Ray McNally, co-author of In Search Of Dracula, photos of an Alfred Hitchcock film premiere for Torn Curtain, the first interview with Jonathan Richman since his sabbatical, and the first coverage of Lou Reed's Rock 'n' Roll Animal tour, September 1, 1973. During this time there was music being developed by the emerging artist in Arlington and Winthrop, Massachusetts, original music being composed as early as 1969 was put to tape on a half-track reel-to-reel with three songs airing on WBCN in 1971 and another three airing in 1972. "Rare Tape Nights" hosted by Buffalo on WBCN were a particular favorite of the writer/performer, and Marc Bolan's acoustic broadcast from that station was taped from the speakers onto a cassette recorder. Giving that tape to an artist signed to the Varulven label years later resulted in that individual sending it overseas where it has, unfortunately, been bootlegged. The artist that sent the private tapes overseas ended up writing the liner notes to the Crosby, Stills & Nash boxed set, go figure.
Two and a half years later the magazine turned into a record label, Boston's original rock label, Varulven. Along with releases by Viglione's own band, The Count, the imprint issued comedian Paul Lovell a.k.a. Blowfish, music by Willie "Loco" Alexander, Thundertrain, Third Rail, Mr. Curt, Unnatural Axe, Fox Pass and other New England region pioneers. In 1978 Patrick Mathe' of Flamingo Records issued their first contract to the twenty-four year old Joe Viglione. Flamingo was a subsidiary of the dance label, Carrere Records, Mathe' releasing a 12" record by another group after having signed Viglione with the debut lp from The Count the label's first album release.
Joe became the house agent for Cantones, an Italian restaurant in the Financial District of Boston, launching his first Rock & Roll Spectacular at The Paradise Theater on June 29, 1978. His showcases brought The Stompers, Mission Of Burma, The Lyres, Thrills, Unnatural Axe, The Neighborhoods and other acts into Boston's best concert club for the very first time. Some of these acts went on to become "house bands" at the club, though as of 2003 Viglione holds the record for performing 49 times in the room where David Johansen filmed his famous Animals medley, where Billy Joel tracked the hit "She's Got A Way", where U2 recorded the flip side of "I Will Follow" and where tons of live concerts by The Cars, Bette Midler,Blondie and other acts were taped, usually by Starfleet, which also recorded the second Count Spectacular.
Around this period Varulven Magazine started publishing a regular column on Lou Reed's work. At a Reed show in Paradise Philip Milstein obtained a copy of the Jonathan Richman issue of Varulven, the issue that declared it was time for "The Velvets Appreciation Society." Milstein contacted Viglione and said he would start "The Velvet Underground Appreciation Society", with Joe contributing to the first few issues of that fan club's magazine. Viglione was also writing a monthly column in Musician's Magazine, and would go on to pen articles for The Boston Globe, The Real Paper, The Improper Bostonian, Preview, The Beat, Discords, a commentary in Billboard Magazine (August 31, 1992), his record company scribblings in CMJ, along with liner notes to the various compilation albums his label was releasing, most notably the Moe Tucker/Count e.p. Another View, a title which Polygram utilized later for their own sequel to the V.U. disc. Joe had sent copies to Bill Levenson, producer of the V.U. and the "other" Another View album, with Jimmy Miller and Joe Viglione in Levenson's office while the next "V.U." was in the planning stages. A little beyond coincidence that Joe's brilliant play on words "another vee you - another view" (of The Velvet Underground) would both be composed by two different individuals. Joe had already sent copies of his "another look" at the V.U. album (different versions of Foggy Notion and "I'm Sticking With You") to Levenson, so after the meeting, sent them again. CMJ reviewed both discs simultaneously refusing to call the original EP "Another View". As James Brown said about the record business on a New Music Seminar panel with Lou Reed and Madonna about giving your ideas to the record industry...
In 1980 Viglione became the A & R rep for Mathe's new European label signing Willie Alexander to New Rose / RCA after the split up of MCA recording act The Boom Boom Band. Billboard Magazine interviewed him the day the Loco disc hit the American shores. In 1983 Varulven act The Daughters became the back-up band for Johnny Thunders, the former New York Doll who was being produced by legendary Rolling Stones' producer Jimmy Miller, not to be confused with Varulven Magazine writer Jim Miller. Manager Jim Nestor brought the tapes to Joe's attention and after meeting with Miller at Euphoria Sound Studios, Viglione signed Thunders to a deal with New Rose Records, now distributed by Musidisc in Europe. Thunders, The Count and The Daughters had a record release party at The Paradise Nightclub, of course. In Cold Blood by Johnny Thunders became the biggest selling record for the New Rose Label in the mid 1980's.
Jimmy Miller then recorded the third Count album, The Intuition Element, for New Rose, eventually forming a production company with Joe called Miller/Viglione Productions. This synergy resulted in an artistic achievement when Buddy Guy recorded five sides with the pair, Miller producing Genya Ravan, Jo Jo Laine and Aerosmith guitarist Joe Perry on the sessions, Viglione producing Nils Lofgren on the tapes. Offers from the record industry were not what Guy's manager was interested in at the time, and the recordings have stayed in the vaults. In a strange twist of fate it was Viglione's PR work with former Joe Perry wife Elissa Perry which brought Buddy Guy to the team's attention. It was Willie Alexander's ex-wife, Billie Montgomery, former art director for Varulven, and now married to Joe Perry, who negotiated Perry's involvement on the Buddy Guy tapes.
Miller/Viglione's next project was former wife of Wings guitarist Denny Laine, the Jo Jo Laine album after some interest from Arista. Jo Jo managed The Mannish Boys out of the U.K. and Miller/Viglione attracted attention from Motown in America on this project tracking four songs at Normandy Sound in Warren, Rhode Island.
In 1988 Miller/Viglione Productions moved to Mission Control Studios where a band called New Kids On The Block emerged. It was a time of transition. A live "Count" album was recorded, as was live material by Unnatural Axe, a band whose debut EP on the label in 2003 sells for $225.00 on Gemm.com, with the track "They Saved Hitler's Brain", produced by Viglione, appearing on the Rhino/Atlantic release Mass Ave., a compilation of Boston area music.
In 1991 Joe began producing legendary disc jockey Harvey Wharfield's Boston Music Showcase with The Demo That Got The Deal - a series of interviews with Jonathan Richman, J.Geils frontman Peter Wolf, Letters To Cleo, Barry Tashian of The Remains, Didi Stewart, Charlie Farren and other New England rockers playing their demos and telling how they landed their record or publishing deals. Rare tracks like RTZ's live version of "Dreams" (featuring ex-members of the band Boston, the pre-J.Geils Band The Hallucinations, the original lost 4 track demo of The Fools "Psycho Chicken" and other nuggets were aired on the show, Viglione and Greg Hawkes of The Cars cleaning up that band's original demos for Hawkes interview on the show ("The demo That Got The Deal" is referenced twice in Rhino's Cars Deluxe re-issue of the band's first album). They played Aimee Mann's "I Should've Known" before any radio station in the world. The show moved to a variety of different AM and FM stations, Viglione becoming program director of AM 1670 on March 11, 2000.
Simultaneous with the production work at 93.7 FM in 1992 Viglione became head of A & R for CD Review Magazine's label for Wayne Green Enterprises. Joe signed Spirit releasing a new version of "Nature's Way" featuring Sara Fleetwood on vocals (then wife of Mick Fleetwood) which got AAA radio attention, and Better Generation, a new album from Marty Balin of The Jefferson Airplane. As Epic/Legacy was about to reissue Spirit product on the double disc entitled Time Circle, the band leader Randy California asked Viglione to help negotiate the deal. This resulted in photographs from California's collection and insight being added to that retrospective.
The return to television was inevitable, his original TV Eye show from 1979 having been produced by eventual Executive Producer of Madonna's Truth Or Dare film, Jay Roewe. The idea for Visual Radio-Television got shelved when Joe was hired as Director of Research for national TV company North American Media. They developed PBS specials for actor Paul Sorvino and mezzo soprano Marilyn Horne. During his time with North American Media while negotiating a possible PBS special for The Jefferson Starship (and a meeting where Reverend Paul Kantner granted him absolution, dressed like a priest), Visual Radio-Television was launched with an extensive Marty Balin interview and some rare and exclusive Jefferson Starship footage. In 8 years the show has taped 300 interviews, concerts and lectures including Laurie Anderson, Richard Branson, Greg Hawkes of The Cars, Linda Ronstadt, Professor Stephen Hawking and many others. It was the 1999 interview with Suzanne Vega which was picked up by the All Media Guide which led to Joe's writing articles for AMG. He is writing a book on Lou Reed's 1973 Rock 'n' Roll Animal tour, continuing to produce TV and radio, and archiving thirty years of recordings for possible reissues, writing liner notes (penning the essay to the re-release of Andy Pratt's first album Records Are Like Life, among others). He is working on his fifth film, The Salt Water Summers (formerly The Summer Wind), with appearances scheduled by sixties stars Diane Renay, Barbara Harris of The Toys, Bobby Hebb, Buzzy Linhart, Eddie Rambeau, Marty Balin and others.
The original "Count" album on Flamingo/Carrere is selling for over $50.00 on Musicstack.com and Gemm.com while various 45's by Willie Alexander, Moe Tucker as well as the two Count eps are going for $25.00 - $35.00 or more. The materials show up on eBay, and other sites, the internet giving new exposure to the pioneering label created by Boston's singer/songwriter "for artists by artists", a tag and philosophy that Propeller Records and Wampus Media, two labels that came later, also embraced. Post Script:
Sven H. Rossel states in A History of Scandinavian Literature, 1870-1980, (1982) that "Aksel Sandemose is one of the few writers who seriously delved into the teachings of psychoanalysis and thereby became a writer. Like Strindberg and Dostoevsky, he discovered that the irrational is real; his writing is a constant attempt to track down this incomprehensible element. The chaotic nature of his books is traceable solely to this monomaniacal obsession, which for him represented the fight for his own soul."
(Sven H. Rossel in A History of Scandinavian Literature, 1870-1980, 1982)
In 2007 the good people at Varulven Records are carefully transferring the precious analog tapes to digital, designing new artwork and booklets for each recording, and preparing these historical works for distribution in the new millennium - via digital download as well as traditional packaging. Varulven is Boston's Original Rock Label (tm) and 2007 is just the beginning of an exciting new chapter in our history.
P.O. Box 2392
Woburn, MA 01888
It is August 11, 2007 at 2:06 AM. In about ten hours I will be interviewing Jay and The Americans at WCAT in Winthrop, Marty Sanders being an old friend of both Jimmy Miller and Buzzy Linhart, someone I haven't seen in about twenty years. Ahhh the days of frequent trips to New York City when Jimmy and I would shop our variety of master tapes to the record labels. In this new era of the record business, with the entire "system" allegedly in turmoil, it is safe to say that things are still as stagnant as ever on the major label level. The initial drive that made recordings of the sixties so valuable and important has been replaced by homogenized product that has little sustainability. Justin Timberlake might as well be Frosted Flakes, tastes good to those who like it, but overexposed and failing to capture the imagination of people of all ages. The Beatles opened the door and continue to please audiences from all walks of life, from all generations. There's enough mystery in each Beatles track to keep the listeners happy, despite consultants and other business types putting walls up so that creativity can't flourish.
The on-air personalities have little personality these days and we independent labels continue to do the heavy lifting - be it in A & R or in the preservation of the material that we enjoy and continue to believe in.
Varulven, specifically this journalist/tv host, has put some serious time into regional acts as well as international artists. One of the biggest problems facing the artists I choose to work with is their level of seriousness when compared to that of those who came before. I'm also finding a shockingly high number of artists - both new and old - who hold onto the belief that marijuana makes for good music. It doesn't. Varulven takes a hard line when it comes to drugs. The question of pot being a "gateway" drug I'll leave to the experts; the problem with smoking dope is that it puts the artist on a wavelength that I find it hard to communicate with. Furthermore, this "eternal siesta" is an attitude that is in direct conflict with my round-the-clock work ethic. With the major labels being so ignorant of creativity and the needs that go along with it, songwriters and musicians need more than ever before to have a clear mind and a healthy attitude. After 25 years I finally got out of the unbreakable BMI contract (poor Charlie Feldman at BMI just doesn't have a clue when it comes to the needs of the artists; BMI just wants to pull members into their vacuum so they can toss a big number around. "THREE HUNDRED THOUSAND MEMBERS"...ho hum...yeah, but Charlie can you sing 5 songs from any of those 300,000 members? Charlie was having a hard enough time searching Google for BMI information when I sat in his office. OK, so when the Performance Rights Organizations are acting like record labels and giving the brush-off to their own artists, "writer relation persons" more interested in getting an A & R position with the majors than taking care of "the little songwriter" (what a demeaning term), well, it's up to us to do the work, people. As Dave Davies of The Kinks said to me as I set up the camera to do an interview with him back in 1999 "D.I.Y." Yep! Do it yourself.
Now with the internet we can do just that. Varulven has some great ideas and a great work ethic. We also have some tremendous songs and recordings that have stood the test of time. Older and wiser, like fine wine, we are taking on the world again. Established in 1976 this is our 31st year. Some of those very original titles are going to be back in circulation sounding better than ever.
Enclosed is my long-winded biography. Feel free to write me: firstname.lastname@example.org to discuss how Varulven can better bring the music you need to the marketplace. Thanks for reading.
2:21 AM August 11
SOME VELVET UNDERGROUND STUFF - here's a cool blog with Velvets related stuff
Blog To Comm: Foggy Notion - Velvet Underground and relation to Varulven Records
Here's BLOG TO COMM's comments on an issue of VARULVEN:
(One final parenthetical note: my current mini-obsession with Boston-bred Velvets homage stems from an issue of Count Joseph Viglione's VARULVEN fanzine, an early 1975 ish at that before the mag went totally into rock music! In this issue amidst the horror movie info and Alfred Hitchcock pix was an article on Lou Reed and the Velvet Underground, a nice albeit typically fanzine-esque piece which gives some of the Count's views on the man called Lou and his music for all that was worth [and to me it was worth PLENTY]. What striked me most about this piece was not what was said, which had pretty much been said before, but the closing remarks about the Modern Lovers and their Velvetness as well as the Kids and their cover of "Foggy Notion"[!]...not to mention some group called "The Astrals" who the Count told us were carrying on the tradition!!!!! Having never heard of the Astrals and certainly wanting to, I emailed Mr. Viglione to no avail. Even a Velvets maniac like Imants Krumins drew a blank making me toss out the question to YOU, dear blog reader. So, does anyone out there have any concrete [or even cement...hee hee, the blogmeister must have his little joke!] information on these Astrals? Any help would be appreciated!)
This was my second article for REPLICATION NEWS, probably the September 1999 issue. The long-established publication became MEDIALINE in the new millennium. Miller/Freeman was the publisher, they sold out to United Entertainment Media. Replication News/Medialine folded in 2007.
Joe Viglione's interview with Shawn Britton on the Mobile Fidelity versions of the first 2 Velvet Undergound albums on GOLD CDDiscussion of joe Vig's Velvet Underground mastering by Shawn Britton
Mobile Fidelity Releases Two Velvet Underground Discs on Gold
By Joe Viglione
On August 4, 1999, Shawn Britton spoke with us from his office at Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs in California. The release of these
two classic discs, "The Velvet Undrground & Nico" and "White Light/White Heat" might surprise.
Long before Spinal Tap went over the top, Lou Reed, John Cale, Moe Tucker and Sterling Morrison rolled into the studio and cranked their amps to 11 (well, Moe on drums had to crank above the din). One can easily believe the urban myths concerning the shock producer Tom Wilson might've felt...- "White Light/White Heat" is the tour-de-force wall of noise that "...& Nico" only hinted at.
To hear seventeen minutes and thirty four seconds of "Sister Ray" after being re-processed by The Gain System of Mobile Fidelity on this Ultradisc II is truly a unique experience. I had to get the scoop from the guy who's job it is to translate these precious masters to gold...
RN: You've been engineering at Mobile Fidelity
for how many years?
SB: Tomorrow it will be 14 years. Started here
RN: What was your first position at MFSL?
SB: Tape duplication, actually, we made pre-recorded cassettes onto Chrome BASF tape
and special high tech cassette shells, etc.
RN: Were you involved with the Half Speed
SB: The half-speed mastering was cutting
lacquers on a hald-speed Neumann lathe and not until a couple of years back, 97 I think or 96 we
started producing a product called the Amidisc 200 - 200 gram LPs, we eventually purchased
a pressing plant in Southern California, and brought it up here to Northern California, we're
about two hours north of San Francisco. Started
pressing 200 gram records - this heavy duty vinyl, in fact, we are the only people to ever make 200 gram records like that.
It became too much of a burden to the company to produce records...this is a really small company. People have an idea that because we're global, and we've been at this since 1977, people have this image that we're this huge company. We're not. We have visitors from Europe that come on vacation that want to swing by MoFi and they - invariably - they get a tour of the building and say "where's the rest of the building." It's not a big operation, we have big ideas, but it's a small operation.
Emotionally and from a sonic standpoint (the records) were something we wanted to pursue, but business-wise we just couldn't maintain it. Over the years as records were phased out from retailers, there's not even bins to hold them
anymore. So what used to be our distribution network and our mom & pop stores have effectively vanished.
RN: The two Velvet Underground CDs,
"The Velvet Underground & Nico" and
"White Light/White Heat", they came out
around a year apart?
SB: I think so, Joe, you've gotta remember,
that my memory is really selective. It selects
what it wants to pull up.
RN: Do you engineer a lot of records in a week?
SB: Well, no, what sets Mobile Fidelity apart from your standard record company is that we really take our time. Some projects can take weeks. That's one luxury I have. Standard mastering, I did some work down at MCA records a few years back, archival stuff, and it appeared to me that they were putting out two or three cds a day.
Getting the projects mastered, and then they'd send it off to make parts, the digital masters.
Whereas it can take me anywhere from a week and a half up to over a month to do one album.
SB: The boss calls the normal procedure mastering by the pound. And it's true, you just
have to chop 'em out. You gotta get it done,
and they are under a deadline to get things to
market. We're not under any deadlines, we release them when we want. I'm given a lot of leeway. I'll do an album, complete it, listen very
carefully and if I'm not absolutely pleased I'll tell the scheduling department "I need more time."
I want this to be the absolutely best version that
I can get out there to market because these gold
CDs last forever. People are going to listen to
this work, hopefully, twenty years from now and
say "Wow, Mofi did a good job."
RN: You have no fear that they will Oxidize
as some people fear aluminum ones
SB: Well you know, Joe, honestly, aluminum
discs should not oxidize in our lifetime...but
to digress, I had a guy from Florida call me onetime and he said "I've been storing some
CDs in my fishtank, and I think they're starting to kinda get CD rot on the edges. What do you think? I told him, well, first off, don't store your
CDs in your fish tank.
RN: Is this a joke? In an empty fish tank?
SB: No, in the water! I think he wanted to see what would happen to his discs!
RN: Oh, man...
SB: I love people...the thing about gold...
back in 87 or so we started researching different
metals to sputter onto the polycarbonate sub...
and we looked at platinum, nickel, some alloys,
gold and we found that the gold...Hi Karen,
our PR Director Karen Thomas is here...we found that gold had not only higher reflectivity than the others, but gold makes an incredible atomic bond to the substrength, it sputters very very well.
It's called the metalization process by the way.
Gold will never oxidize. And as a benefit of this, the way they lay it down onto the polycarbonite
it makes for very smooth even coating, that's why gold is used in electrical contact, not just oxidation resistance, it's a very smooth coat. And in terms of a compact disc, there's no pin holes where...in the early days of aluminum discs if you hold one up to a strong backlight, you can see pin holes in there...
SB: It kind of looks like stars on a night sky, and what that means is your air correction circuitry
in your cd player will be enabled...well its got to guess at that missing data...and with gold you don't get those pin holes. So that was something that we discovered at the time and thought "well, this is great" and as far as sonics, what that yields is a more stable image in your soundstage, and in exhaustive tests.... we've been vindicated after doing this for so many years...in the industry people said "oh this is a gimmick, their trying to
make more money." Well, independent of MoFi I think Polygram Europe did exhaustive tests on this and engineers can tell in A/B switching which is an aluminum disc and which is a gold disc just from the stabilization of the imaging.
Shawn Britton, part 2
RN: Now Columbia Records released gold discs,
they had Spirit's "The Twelve Dreams Of Dr. Sardonicus" in release. But they also give
material to you, the Blood Sweat & Tears record,
for example. Why do they do some gold discs
in house, and give some to MoFi?
SB: Well, actually, we have gone back and re-mastered some things that they released on gold and I think their gold master sound series...
I think its discontinued. It's a prohibitively expensive process and the replication costs is high. Because its going to be in Replication News
it says right on the discs, by Zomac Optical out there in Minnesota...we are allowed licensing on titles and the odd part - one would think there would be competition in the marketplace. I guess as far as Columbia feels and it works through their special projects division they probably feel
"well, we're going to make our money on this" so what the heck we'll just make extra money by licensing this out. In reality, these gold discs,
this is a niche market...that's direct competition,
so I can't explain the justification why Columbia
would release something on one hand, and then license it out on the other. I just assume that a company that huge, they don't talk to one another.
In the early 80's when we were producing compact discs, Mobile Fidelity had a distinct advantage in A to D converters and high end
gear because we're sort of a hybrid, if you will,
a mastering house that uses high end audiofile
type gear that you can go down to your local
hi fi store and pick up. Theta Digital projects
things of that nature, Nelson Pass amplification, and we have pro audio gear as well. And way
back when most record companies, a)they didn't take the time b)they didn't have the gear like we do but now there's mastering houses in these
major record companies that have gear that
rivals ours. We don't have as much of a technolofical advantage beause digital technology has come along so much in the last ten yeas.
Think about it in terms of computers, things change very very rapidly. I think as far as PCM
audio is concerned we're approaching the maximum threshold as far as revolution with
96k sample rate and 24 bit work length. That's just about the ceiling - and that's partly why Mobile Fidelity is using the DSD technology from Sony
is because the resolution on it is so incredible.
The DSD is bit stream technology It's the technology that will be used in its full resolution on
the super audio cd, SACD, which we will be coming out with in a couple of months. You'll be seeing Mobile Fidelity releasing some Super Audio titles, it's a high res format Joe.
The Super Audio CD - it has the capability to have a hybrid disc, that will play your normal compact disc layer or the red book spec layer, and it's got a high resolution layer, which will allow you to play the high res super audio cd layer, which is what the DSD - so as far as product is concerned...right now what Mobile Fidelity does...and what we did...the first (DSD) title was Tom Petty's "Full Moon Fever."
part 3, tape 2
RN: Back to the master tapes you get, does
Mobile Fidelity ever bake or restore tapes?
SB: We don't own these tapes, we have our own
restoration techniques, but we do not ever bake
a record company tape, that's up to them.
RN: When you cut half-speed mastering vinyl, did that include the "Gain" system used on these Velvet Underground discs?
SB: Well, yes, the Gain system, when it was introduced, was an upgrade to both mastering chains, the analog and the digital side. And on the analog side we had Nelson Pass, who is a high end designer - he worked at Threshold for
many years sold that company, now he's got Pass Laboratories. Nelson built us a complete cutting rack system with a control unit and these cutting amplifiers to drive the cutter head of our Neumann Lathe VMN 70 lathe which cuts at half speed. Now with half speed it was really developed to its maximum potential by JVC in the 70's for cutting quad, if you remember quad. Well the JVC version of Quad had to have a 50k carrier cycle, this frequency which allowed you to adjust your matrix for proper trackimg. Well, 50K is an insane frequency to cut, it burns up most cutter heads so in order to do that they used a half speed technology wherein you run the tape at half speed and you run the lathe at half speed, and then you're able to get incredible frequency.
And that's why Mobile Fidelity, as it began with Brad Miller, he contacted Sam Ricker at the JVC cutting center in L.A. and they cut some - primarily sound effects records, trains and things of that nature, Brad used to do location recording for audiofile stuff. I'm sure you remember back in the early days of hi fi people would have these recordings of trains which would go from one side of your stereo to the other...it was a demo record.
Well then they took this technology and they thought "why don't we cut some music" and they approached some record labels and licencsed the Mystic Moods Orchestra then they licensed John Klemmers Touch, a number of early software titles like that, and cut half speed and the results were just stunning.
Compared to what other record labels were doing
back then, it just knocked the audio file world on its ear. The MoFi version of "Dark Side Of The
Moon" is still very, very desirable on lp and on the UHQR Ultra High Quality Record, which was pressed by JVC on the Super Vinyl Compound.
RN: So they were a competitor of yours back
SB: Well actually, they pressed our records for us in Japan...that's what the whole half speed
thing was about. And then the other side of the mastering chain was the digital end, where we
had Theta Digital...Theta built us this hot rod A to D converter, that used incredible oversampling and then its decimated down to sixteen bits for CD purposes at the 44.1K sample rate...and that was the first "Gain" system in that incarnation at that time. Since that time i think it was last year we came out with "Gain II" which was an upgrade to our Studer Tape Transport by Tim deParavacini, and we've got ultra wide frequency response now. I have never seen electronic gear have this kind of frequency response. It's phenomenal. If there's something on the master tape, we can capture it now.
RN: Wow. Do you employ the Super Bit Mapping Direct which was introduced by Sony?
SB: We talked about the Sony DSD system that I'm using... Sony started using Super Bit Mapping it's a dithering scheme where you can take longer
word length - let's say 24 bit, and then decimate it down using noise shaping - to the 16 bit 44.1 sample rate for cd purposes, the cd specification.
What MoFi is doing is using DSD, Direct Stream
Digital, which is incredibly high resolution, and then its decimated down using Super Bit Mapping Direct...and this is a very specific process only for DSD...and you should hear, Joe, if you ever get the chance to come out here to California, one we'll go wine tasting, two, you can listen to this DSD, and it is so close to what the master tape
sounds like, it's phenomenal, it's a real step forward for digital. And it's what we call Future Proof because they can decimate it down very easily to different sample rates. Right now I archive everything in this high resolution medium to an A.I.P. tape and then decimate it down later for release on a compact disc.
So we have the capability now to do the Super
Audio CD's for the high resolution layer and for
the standard CD redbook spec layer. It's all
RN: And one more question about Ultradisc.
You have the Gain System, and then you
have Ultradisc. Is that a name for the disc,
or is that a process as well?
SB: Well, Ultradisc was a name for the high end line of CDs we were coming out with, and that
started back in '87, like I said it's hard to remember that far back exactly when we released
these gold discs. It's not necessarily tied to the gold sputter...it was more a separate product line than the standard aluminum cd. So Ultradisc as far as the years have gone by, were referred to
the Gold CDs, and then Ultradisc II was a new formulation of the Gold CDs, improved sub straight or pit formation if you will, more gold being deposited on for more reflectivity. In fact now with Zomax Optical we have some of the lowest error rates in the industry. They are a tremendous, tremendous replicator. I've been
nothing but pleased with their quality. They're phenomenal. If we have any questions or any
points to bring up with them they immediately jump on it. This is high ticket stuff, it's really the
best that CD replication has to offer.
RN: OK, now one final question on Mobile
Fidelity and then we'll get to The Velvet Underground. The Ultradisc then is a combination of the Gain System and the gold cds...
SB: Well, the Gain system is the mastering chain...actually its Gain II now. so Gain II
is not just used for gold cds. Gain II because its our mastering chain - is also going to be used for the Super Audio CDs and we have some DVD's
coming out, so Gain II is really the mastering chain. The Ultradisc is a software. Now, our
DVD's when they come out, are not going to be
called Ultradiscs or Ultradisc II they're going to have their own name.
RN: Ok now we have to digress again. You brought up Quad Records, I heard that a lot of the Quad Records will turn into DVD's first because they're already separated.
SB: Well some have, actually, some ...I don't know if they're DVD's, but Brad Miller had gone back with his 5.1 records and they released on DTS...you have to have a processor to play it back and you have discreet channels for Surroundsound...and it is phenomenal...
RN: So the Quad Joplin "Pearl" album and Santana's Quad "Abraxas" . and even the Carpenters had one. The one pretty much available is The Doors Greatest Hits...Elektra seemed to press a lot of them - perhaps these will be the first...
SB: It's hard to find systems anymore, the actual
hardware to play them back.
There was no specification for DVD A If you release titles under the DVD video specifcation, if players come out later and they won't play these discs, its going to be confusing for the consumer, it confuses the market place so we've been sort of waiting to see how things shake out and we'll begin releasing our DVD's here in a couple of months.
OK, that's my interview with Shawn Britton on remastering the Velvet Underground.
Want to go further down the rabbit hole? Of course you do...
talk to Janis...